Pradyut Manikya Debbarma is busy these days. Top politicians, including Assam Chief Minister Himanta Biswa Sarma and Tripura Chief Minister Manik Saha, seek his appointment. BJP chief J P Nadda and the party's top leader Amit Shah invite him to Delhi for talks. CPM stalwarts Manik Sarkar and Rahul Gandhi want an alliance with him. But, 45-year-old Pradyut remains unfazed. His demand: Formation of a new state, Greater Tipraland, under articles 2 and 3 of the Indian constitution.
Like for politicians, getting an audience with Pradyut is not easy for a journalist too. He is always surrounded by partymen who keep him away from journalists. When THE WEEK reached Tripura Palace late at night, the gate was closed. The gate-man refused us entry despite an appointment with the self-styled king of Tripura. "Raja Babu cannot meet you," came the sharp reply.
When reminded about the appointment, the surprised leader said he was sending a man. But, even that took 30 minutes. Finally, after a long two-hour wait, around 10 pm, Pradyut came ready for the interview.
Excerpts:
Why is the king angry?
Ans. The king is not angry. He is very happy. You have met me. Where is the sign of anger?
I saw the speech you gave. You seemed angry about the plight of tribals -starving and dying due to bad health issues.
Ans. Yes, that is the truth. But, I am not angry. I am very much polite and humble. When Sadguru says people are dying, you say that it is a message. But when I say the same, you say I am angry. Gussa mein kuch nehin milta (one can get nothing through anger). The people of Tripura are good, honest people. It is politicians who make one community fight another.
But, the disparity between Bengalis and tribals existed for a long, not just during the last five years.
Yes, for seven decades. But, when do you expect me to raise the issue? Six decades back? How old am I?
At least 20 years back...
Okay. What was my age 20 or 25 years back?
Could be around 20 to 25...
At 25, should I talk about this or about having a girlfriend?
But, the disparity between Bengalis and tribals has existed for a long time and you never raised the issue when you were Congress chief in Tripura.
If you watch my speeches for the last 10 years, I have continuously talked about it. I played a key role in the anti-CAA movement and also participated in the anti-AFSPA movement. Problem is that I was not getting media coverage then.
Q Did you leave Congress because it did not support you?
No. I was booted out by the leadership.
You never demanded a separate state for tribals in the past. Why such a drastic change?
In the last 20 years, I have changed my views. What is wrong in that?
But, you never demanded a separate state for tribals in the past.
I have no qualms about admitting it if I am wrong. My views have changed in the last 20 years. What is wrong with that? People's views change with time. For instance, the communists of Bengal accepted they made mistakes, so their workers migrated to TMC and BJP. Those who voted for Jyoti Babu and Buddhadeb Babu are now voting for Narendra Modi.
But, you are not a common man. You are a royal.
But we have the same skin and the same blood.
Allow me to give an example to explain my confusion. BJP-ally Indigenous People’s Front of Tripura raised the demand for a separate state in 2018. You were also in active politics then, but you were not heard.
The leader of the IPFT (the late N.C. Debbarma) raised the hope of the people for Tipraland. They expected him to walk the talk. But, he let them down. That is because he was swayed by the comfort of power. He even kept mum during the anti-CAA movement as that would have soured his relationship with the BJP. Joining the BJP government was his biggest mistake.
Why shouldn't the Bengalis and Tribals live together?
Because of politicians. There are poor Bengalis and poor tribals. But, the divide has been created long back by politicians. We have to rework the equation between these two communities.
How that can be done?
Through constitutional amendments where tribal people would get something, and Bengalis would lose nothing. We (the royal family) helped Bengalis during Noakhali riots and the Bangladesh war. So, Bengalis should also understand the demand of Janajatis (indigenous people).
Nothing wrong with that. But, why do many feel you are dividing people?
An outsider Bengali like you may understand that, but Bengalis of our state don't. They call me anti-Indian. However, there is a change now. Communists want to talk to us as they understood the issues we are talking about.
Please state your demands in simple words.
I want nothing but the protection of indigenous people in the tribal areas along with the protection of Bengalis who are living there. Also protection of indigenous people in 36 villages outside ADC (tribal areas autonomous district council) areas where Bengalis are dominant in number.
For a king, everybody has to be the same. If you walk through the streets of Agartala, Bengalis, who loved you once, call you reactionary now.
That is a misfortune. Royal family has never been communal. We are connected to Bengalis, Assamese, Nepalis, Manipuris and who not.
Yes, you are connected to Coch Behar royal family and the Rajasthani royal family too.
Everywhere. We are the symbol of unity. But, the political atmosphere in Tripura is such that you expect a tribal to be angry. That’s why you asked 'why I was angry.'
What happened to the Rs 30 cr allotted for the hospital and 10 crores for the janajati hostel in Agartala?
Money for the hospital came in December 2021. A hospital cannot come up in one year. The tender for work has been issued. As far as the hostel is concerned, Rs 10 crore is still with the state government. If we were so corrupt, then why do they want an alliance with us?
Himanta Biswa Sarma spoke to you....
Why should he be singled out? The chief minister spoke to me, so has J.P. Nadda ji. I advise you don’t take politicians’ words seriously....
You are not a politician then.
No, I am not.
State highways are being rebuilt...
Not in the ADC areas. BJP’s Agartala budget is equal to the entire ADC budget, while the population of Agartala is just two per cent of the ADC population.
You have kept your door open to the BJP.
My door is open for everyone including the Congress, the TMC, the BJP and the CPI(M). I told everyone that we are fighting for the improvement of the lives of the people. I talk to Uddhav Thackeray and Rahul Gandhi, who is a good friend of mine. I even talk to Mamata ji. I talk to everyone. Vajpayee ji used to talk to everyone. Was he wrong?
What about power sharing after the elections?
Let the winner give us [their promise] in writing, then we will sit down with them.
City people loved you as a king. But, today they say the king played divisional politics.
What can I do?
You need to reach out to them.
What can I do if people have misconceived ideas? See, everything these days depend on the propaganda machinery you have. One machinery says Rahul Gandhi is Pappu, which he is not. The same machinery said Modi has a 56-inch chest, which is also not true.
Would you like to be chief minister?
No.
From the king, you are becoming kingmaker.
We believe that God makes kings. I am not God.
Then, are you a social reformer?
Before leaving politics, I would like to give indigenous people their due. I have many things to do after that, like gardening, maybe marrying, or even listening to music. I am a totally different man who does not need power. I have seen what power is as both my parents used to be MPs.
But, the election needs money.
Yes, I know that. I have sold a lot of my property. I sold land in Kolkata and elsewhere. I sold jewellery too. My parents were MPs, and they fought Marxist Nripen Chakraborty. Ironically, he was one of the most honest politicians in India. But those days are over.
So, you don’t want anything out of your movement!
I could earn a good name before death. That is enough.
Why so much disillusionment?
I am not at all disillusioned. I want to make a mark. If my people are happy, then they may write my name in history. I have nothing to lose because I am a post privy purse monarch in India.