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Chidambaram interview: UPA won't scrap Rafale deal; will renegotiate

Interview with P. Chidambaram, Congress leader and former Union minister

Father’s support: P. Chidambaram with his son Karti | Vibi Job

P. CHIDAMBARAM IS BUSY campaigning in Sivaganga, from where his son, Karti P. Chidambaram, is contesting. At a public rally, Chidambaram asks people if they remember the demonetisation and its consequences. As the audience nods, he moves on to the Rafale deal. “Do you know the scam in the deal? Let me explain to those who do not know,” he says. In three minutes, he deftly outlines the specialities of the aircraft, the agreement during the Congress regime, what the Narendra Modi government did and what he claims the scam is. As he ends the speech, he says, “Karti is not new to this constituency. You all know him. He lives here in Managiri village. He will be at your disposal, if you vote for him.” Amid the hectic schedule, Chidambaram spoke to THE WEEK about everything from farmers’ distress to the Congress’s proposed minimum income guarantee scheme—NYAY—and from Modi’s chowkidar plank to money that was written off by the government in insolvency-resolved cases. Edited excerpts:

The NYAY scheme will cost only 03.6 lakh crore, after its full implementation, covering five crore families. That works out to be less than one per cent of the GDP.
Chowkidars are appointed by rich people. So, if Modi is calling himself a chowkidar, evidently he is admitting that he is the chowkidar of the rich people.

You travelled countrywide to prepare the Congress manifesto. What is the mood of the people?

The Congress manifesto has become a talking point and its promises will have an impact on the way people vote. The people are extremely disappointed that Modi wasted a historic mandate. The unemployment [rate] is at an all time high in 45 years, small and medium businesses have been devastated, and there is a great sense of insecurity among all sections of the people, particularly women, dalits and minorities. The people expected the Congress party to present a bold and forward-looking manifesto that will address the real issues of the people—poverty among 20 per cent of the population, farmers’ distress and unemployment.

You said Congress manifesto is the talking point now. And BJP seems to be rattled. Being the chairman of the manifesto committee, what do you have to say about the manifesto?

I don’t claim the ownership of the manifesto’s ideas. It was a team effort. And ultimately the Congress Working Committee approved it. We are happy that we were able to capture the aspirations of the people of India and promise bold and radical measures.

Will communal issues play a major role in this election?

The BJP’s attempt to polarise will work to some extent in the Hindi-speaking states of India’s heartland. It will have no impact in the southern states, on the states on the east coast and the states in the north.

Is it like the Congress is trying to woo the minorities?

Rubbish. Every party owes a duty to assure the minorities that they are safe in the country. A party that does not do this is violating the Constitution.

The NYAY scheme promises Rs 72,000 a year to five crore “poorest families”. But, is it possible, given the financial situation of the country?

We have done our math. We will implement the programme. The size of the GDP today is Rs210 lakh crore. In five years it will grow to Rs400 lakh crore. The scheme will cost only 03.6 lakh crore, after its full implementation, covering five crore families. That works out to be less than 1 per cent of the GDP. Is anyone seriously suggesting that India cannot or should not allocate less than 1 per cent of its GDP to meet the requirements of 20 per cent of the population?

But, the BJP says NYAY cannot be implemented.

It cannot be implemented by the BJP. They are not capable of doing that.

On the job front, the Congress says that the Modi government has failed. Can this be immediately corrected if the Congress comes back to power?

The Modi government has failed the people of India. There are around 3.1 crore people looking for a job every day in India; 4.7 crore jobs were destroyed in the last five years. The picture is very stark. There are no quick fixes. We have a whole chapter [in our manifesto] on jobs. What we can do immediately is to fill the four lakh vacancies in the Union government and the 20 lakh vacancies in the state governments. Other steps will be taken one by one, and we hope that in five years we will be able to create a large number of jobs.

Two important poll planks of the BJP are national security and patriotism. Your comment.

Over 100 civil servants have petitioned the Election Commission. Are they patriotic citizens? Over 100 world renowned economists have cautioned about India’s economic future. Are they patriotic citizens? Over 100 eminent writers and poets have deplored the kind of hate that has spread across the country. Are they patriotic citizens? At the rate Modi and his party are dubbing people as unpatriotic, I am afraid at the end of the day only Modi and Amit Shah will be standing as patriotic citizens.

The BJP says only it can deliver a strong response to terrorism.

Between 2004 and 2015, India was absolutely safe. There was not even a war-like situation between India and Pakistan. After 26/11 [2008 Mumbai attacks] there was not a [single] terrorist attack on Indian soil which was traced back to Pakistan. On the contrary, there were several attacks on Indian soil after Modi took over, which have been traced back to Pakistan. Examples are Uri and Pathankot. Infiltrations have increased, the number of casualties among civilians and security forces has increased and Jammu and Kashmir became more alienated than ever before. So, how does Modi claim that he has been able to fight terrorism better than the UPA?

Pakistan Prime Minister Imran Khan said that Modi’s victory will revive peace talks.

It is absolutely shocking. I think that tells this whole story. The Pakistan prime minister and the Indian prime minister seem to be embracing each other, even when terrorist attacks take place on Indian soil.

On Rafale, the Supreme Court is reviewing its earlier ruling.

It was a huge setback for the BJP. The government tried its best through the attorney general to stall the process of review. They went to the extent of accusing the petitioners of using “stolen documents”. It was an absurd argument. I am sure the attorney general knew the law, yet, stated a very different proposition before the Supreme Court. The next day he realised his error. He said the documents were not stolen, but only copied. The government is now putting up a brave face after the judgment.

Whatever be the Rafale judgment, there will eventually be a full and comprehensive enquiry into the Rafale deal.

Do you still insist on a parliamentary committee probe, after the Supreme Court verdict?

Absolutely. The parliamentary committee is the best instrument in any parliament democracy to look into such maleficent actions or alleged maleficent actions by the government.

Don’t you think judiciary will be the last resort?

I cannot hazard a guess, what the judiciary will do. I am sure the judiciary will do what it thinks is right. But whatever the judiciary does, it does not take away from the right of Parliament to look into an alleged scandal.

Will the Congress scrap the agreement if it comes back to power?

No. We chose the Rafale aircraft and we believe it is a good aircraft. There is no reason to scrap an agreement in which we agreed to purchase 36 aircraft. We will try to renegotiate the agreement and acquire all 126 aircraft.

What do you have to say on Modi’s chowkidar plank?

Chowkidars are appointed by rich people. So, if Modi is calling himself a chowkidar, evidently he is admitting that he is the chowkidar of the rich people. And, it is under his watch that Vijay Mallya, Nirav Modi and Mehul Choksi fled India. So we have a chowkidar for rich people. And, that chowkidar failed in his duty.

Recently Modi asked first time voters to vote for the Pulwama martyrs, and for the servicemen who carried out the Balakot attack.

The Indian Army is not contesting the elections. Therefore, to seek votes in the name of the martyrs is clearly exploiting the ultimate sacrifice made by young jawans. I think it is completely unethical.

Do you think demonetisation and GST will have a big impact on this election?

Demonetisation has devastated India’s economy. And GST ruined India’s trade and business, especially the micro, small and medium enterprises. I am confident that millions of people who were affected by demonetisation and GST will express their anger and opposition when they vote. People are asking why should their agricultural loans not be written off when Modi is willing to forgive or forget the huge amounts of money that were swindled by fraudsters, and the huge amount of money that was written off in insolvency-resolved cases. By the way, the latter amounts to, as of today, Rs 84,585 crore.

What, according to you, is the status of the economy now?

Dismal.

Coming to Tamil Nadu, the DMK-Congress alliance is looking for a sweep. Do you think it is possible?

The DMK-Congress alliance was forged for the first time in 1971, for the Lok Sabha elections. Since then this alliance has faced the Lok Sabha elections six times—1971, 1980, 1996, 1998, 2004 and 2009—and has won on all occasions. This is the seventh occasion, and I am absolutely confident that this alliance will do extremely well.

What are Karti’s chances in Sivaganga?

He is a candidate of the secular progressive alliance. As I said, this is a formidable alliance. And, it will repeat its performance as in the past.